Tucson United States
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December 2, 2011
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As a Lottery player I've noticed that since most states don't do their actual drawings, I've noticed that numbers that would have fallen in my state fell in other states and vice versa. With the company useing only 3 machines per drawings for a lot of states the games are very much the same from number of used numbers to actual games played for each state. What I've seen so far is the computers are insuring least pick number for pick 3 games and pick 4 games which are the most popular. They deny it but here in Arizona the amount of winners has fallen so far a lot of players stop playing and their actual printouts show they stay under a 100 winners across the board including box winners. Just wondering if other players have noticed this as well. Is there a pattern with the machines? I believe there is and seeing they are believing no one would figure it out they keep it up. This is why there is a delay in them showing the numbers drawn per state per game. Looking for some feed back on this.
United States
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April 24, 2010
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Quote: Originally posted by spartan1707 on Nov 1, 2017
As a Lottery player I've noticed that since most states don't do their actual drawings, I've noticed that numbers that would have fallen in my state fell in other states and vice versa. With the company useing only 3 machines per drawings for a lot of states the games are very much the same from number of used numbers to actual games played for each state. What I've seen so far is the computers are insuring least pick number for pick 3 games and pick 4 games which are the most popular. They deny it but here in Arizona the amount of winners has fallen so far a lot of players stop playing and their actual printouts show they stay under a 100 winners across the board including box winners. Just wondering if other players have noticed this as well. Is there a pattern with the machines? I believe there is and seeing they are believing no one would figure it out they keep it up. This is why there is a delay in them showing the numbers drawn per state per game. Looking for some feed back on this.
It would be interesting to see results of how many winners versus tickets purchased there were annually when states used ball drawings, and then again after those states switched to computer drawings.
There has just been too many instances of suspicious drawings with computer draws for people to completely trust them. If a lottery draw is done by a computer, it can be "fixed" to do something they want it to. Whether it's fixed by the lottery or by a player like Tipton, it can be done. And no matter how often the lottery officials say they have increased security it still happens. You've heard the saying,"records are made to be broken?" Well, computers are made to be hacked into. No matter what you do to prevent it, someone will figure out how to get around the security measures in place to stop it.
What they should do is, have ball drawings only. No pre tests, no post tests. One drawing that's it. Whatever numbers come up, that's what it is. Now that would be completely random.
They already weigh and /or measure the balls before each drawing. If the result is the same, exact before the next drawing, as it was the last, you're to go. If it isn't, then change the balls. As far as the machines screwing up, think about it, how often does that really happen? I know it does, but they have procedures in place for that. Just follow them.
United States
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March 12, 2015
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From Florida's site.
Florida Lottery drawings are conducted under strict security guidelines and procedures. A Lottery draw manager and an auditor from an independent auditing firm attend and participate in every drawing. These two individuals report to the draw studio at least 90 minutes prior to the actual drawing. The Lottery draw studio and draw equipment vault are located in the basement of the Lottery Headquarters building, which is a secure and limited access facility.This area is also under 24-hour video surveillance.
Okay, so why the pre and post tests? To see if the machines are working properly? Oaky, so they work during the pretest, does that mean they can't fail during the actual drawing because they performed tests?
So would I be correct If i said I dropped my laptop 5 feet from the ground, three consecutive times, and...does this insure insure the laptop will work on the fourth time?........any sane person would say NO!
My friend, the problem lies in multiple testing for no good reason at all. The number you played that showed up in another state probably would have shown in your state, had the officials left the Dang machines alone!!
There are what's called "follower numbers", basically one state drawing the same number from another state on somewhat of a regular basis. There's also sister states too. Patterns that exist with these strategies, and many other strategies, gets skewed, and this leaves the system player with erroneous information that is unreliable.
If you have to play, buy quick picks, not worth studying patterns thanks to the evil lottery officials and their greed.
United States
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April 24, 2010
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If security is a good as they say it is, why do they need to test the machines with pre tests? Ain't nobody going to get near them to mess with anything.
I often wonder if the numbers I play ever come up in the pre tests. If you knew how often they did, then you would know whether what you're doing system wise is working or not. Then you would have to figure out a way to compensate for the pre tests. Unfortunately, only Texas tells you the pre test results. So if you play any where else, we'll never know.
Dump Water Florida United States
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June 5, 2002
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In Predictions I manage to hit Az boxed twice a week with 50 Picks per draw and I'm not among the top ten. You might want to do a little research and see who is doing best and test their picks going forward.
Pretests, arrrrrrrrrrrgh pattern breaking, same logic as pit critters swapping out hot dice and decks.
BobP
When you make a hole in a net you have fewer holes.
United States
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February 13, 2016
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Quote: Originally posted by amber123 on Nov 1, 2017
From Florida's site.
Florida Lottery drawings are conducted under strict security guidelines and procedures. A Lottery draw manager and an auditor from an independent auditing firm attend and participate in every drawing. These two individuals report to the draw studio at least 90 minutes prior to the actual drawing. The Lottery draw studio and draw equipment vault are located in the basement of the Lottery Headquarters building, which is a secure and limited access facility.This area is also under 24-hour video surveillance.
Okay, so why the pre and post tests? To see if the machines are working properly? Oaky, so they work during the pretest, does that mean they can't fail during the actual drawing because they performed tests?
So would I be correct If i said I dropped my laptop 5 feet from the ground, three consecutive times, and...does this insure insure the laptop will work on the fourth time?........any sane person would say NO!
My friend, the problem lies in multiple testing for no good reason at all. The number you played that showed up in another state probably would have shown in your state, had the officials left the Dang machines alone!!
There are what's called "follower numbers", basically one state drawing the same number from another state on somewhat of a regular basis. There's also sister states too. Patterns that exist with these strategies, and many other strategies, gets skewed, and this leaves the system player with erroneous information that is unreliable.
If you have to play, buy quick picks, not worth studying patterns thanks to the evil lottery officials and their greed.
Their point is that it's a mechanical device and it can go wrong which in-turn might cause confusion/trouble during live telecast.
I never heard of any Lottery Association that does test draws for RNGs(Except when they are more concerned about pressing that generate button would actually show numbers instead of funky smiley or blue screen of death(BSOD).
At any point, they can defend themselves because drawings are random(In huge number set games, I am not sure whether removing 10/11 draws will cause a spike - this reduce set is a random set that would be as good as 1/11 or 2/11 --- 11/11(without pre/post tests)). Auditing is also done by a firm.
Until you catch the Manager and Auditor teaming up and using high tech ideas to cheat, then any draw result that is audited and released is good for not just the Florida Lottery Association but also for other players(who don't use methods to pick - Quick picks and lucky number self picks).
If players are really concerned about particular drawing then they have to go through law enforcement and watch the live surveillance videos.
Kentucky United States
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February 14, 2006
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Quote: Originally posted by amber123 on Nov 1, 2017
From Florida's site.
Florida Lottery drawings are conducted under strict security guidelines and procedures. A Lottery draw manager and an auditor from an independent auditing firm attend and participate in every drawing. These two individuals report to the draw studio at least 90 minutes prior to the actual drawing. The Lottery draw studio and draw equipment vault are located in the basement of the Lottery Headquarters building, which is a secure and limited access facility.This area is also under 24-hour video surveillance.
Okay, so why the pre and post tests? To see if the machines are working properly? Oaky, so they work during the pretest, does that mean they can't fail during the actual drawing because they performed tests?
So would I be correct If i said I dropped my laptop 5 feet from the ground, three consecutive times, and...does this insure insure the laptop will work on the fourth time?........any sane person would say NO!
My friend, the problem lies in multiple testing for no good reason at all. The number you played that showed up in another state probably would have shown in your state, had the officials left the Dang machines alone!!
There are what's called "follower numbers", basically one state drawing the same number from another state on somewhat of a regular basis. There's also sister states too. Patterns that exist with these strategies, and many other strategies, gets skewed, and this leaves the system player with erroneous information that is unreliable.
If you have to play, buy quick picks, not worth studying patterns thanks to the evil lottery officials and their greed.
Arizona uses a computer RNG so pre or post tests changes nothing there.
Dump Water Florida United States
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June 5, 2002
3,592 Posts
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Come to think of it, I do think it's pretty good instant karma when after all the pre-tests the official Pick-3 draw is the same exact number as the draw before.
United States
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April 24, 2010
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Quote: Originally posted by thamizhpayan on Nov 5, 2017
Their point is that it's a mechanical device and it can go wrong which in-turn might cause confusion/trouble during live telecast.
I never heard of any Lottery Association that does test draws for RNGs(Except when they are more concerned about pressing that generate button would actually show numbers instead of funky smiley or blue screen of death(BSOD).
At any point, they can defend themselves because drawings are random(In huge number set games, I am not sure whether removing 10/11 draws will cause a spike - this reduce set is a random set that would be as good as 1/11 or 2/11 --- 11/11(without pre/post tests)). Auditing is also done by a firm.
Until you catch the Manager and Auditor teaming up and using high tech ideas to cheat, then any draw result that is audited and released is good for not just the Florida Lottery Association but also for other players(who don't use methods to pick - Quick picks and lucky number self picks).
If players are really concerned about particular drawing then they have to go through law enforcement and watch the live surveillance videos.
Happy Thinking...
Yes something can go wrong at any time with the machines. And they have procedures in place should that happen.
But just because they do X number of pre tests, does not mean the live drawing will go on as planned. Stuff happens. Think about it. How many times do leave you your house to go to work, go shopping, run errands, or whatever. Every thing is fine. You come out to your car and drive to the next place. You go in the store, come out two minutes later and; OH NO!!! Dead battery. Car doesn't start.
Stuff happens... Now that is random.
As far as RNG's, how do you KNOW they are completely random? They are computers, computers are programmed by humans, humans are not perfect. Again, stuff happens.
When Tennessee first switched to RNG's, they were programmed so that no number would repeat in the same drawing. So what did that do? It caused no doubles to be drawn. The players realized something was wrong when there were no doubles drawn for a couple of months. They complained and eventually the state lottery realized / figured out /admitted there was a program error.
Now the question at the time was; Who made the program that way and was it intentional? Who knows for 100% sure on either, but it served to make players not trust RNG's, which continues to this day. Especially so with the recent Eddie Tipton case.
Now think about this. Eddie Tipton was caught because he screwed up. How long would he have continued if he hadn't? Next question; How many more Eddie Tipton's are out there, and are learning from his mistake(s) that haven't been caught?
I don't trust RNG's to be completely honest or random. Do you? I'm not saying ball drawings are completely 100% beyond reproach either, what with the pre tests and all, and they too have been fixed in the past, but I will take them over RNG's any day.
New Hampshire United States
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May 8, 2017
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Quote: Originally posted by BobP on Nov 6, 2017
Come to think of it, I do think it's pretty good instant karma when after all the pre-tests the official Pick-3 draw is the same exact number as the draw before.
United States
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February 13, 2016
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Quote: Originally posted by grwurston on Nov 6, 2017
Yes something can go wrong at any time with the machines. And they have procedures in place should that happen.
But just because they do X number of pre tests, does not mean the live drawing will go on as planned. Stuff happens. Think about it. How many times do leave you your house to go to work, go shopping, run errands, or whatever. Every thing is fine. You come out to your car and drive to the next place. You go in the store, come out two minutes later and; OH NO!!! Dead battery. Car doesn't start.
Stuff happens... Now that is random.
As far as RNG's, how do you KNOW they are completely random? They are computers, computers are programmed by humans, humans are not perfect. Again, stuff happens.
When Tennessee first switched to RNG's, they were programmed so that no number would repeat in the same drawing. So what did that do? It caused no doubles to be drawn. The players realized something was wrong when there were no doubles drawn for a couple of months. They complained and eventually the state lottery realized / figured out /admitted there was a program error.
Now the question at the time was; Who made the program that way and was it intentional? Who knows for 100% sure on either, but it served to make players not trust RNG's, which continues to this day. Especially so with the recent Eddie Tipton case.
Now think about this. Eddie Tipton was caught because he screwed up. How long would he have continued if he hadn't? Next question; How many more Eddie Tipton's are out there, and are learning from his mistake(s) that haven't been caught?
I don't trust RNG's to be completely honest or random. Do you? I'm not saying ball drawings are completely 100% beyond reproach either, what with the pre tests and all, and they too have been fixed in the past, but I will take them over RNG's any day.
Tipton would have been caught even if he had hatched a big plan and used unknow or know people to win and share winnings(kind of percentage based) for sometime/years. Involving too many people would lead to many ears evesdropping and somehow he would have got himself caught that's why he bought the hot lotto ticket(not letting others know there is a definite chance to win but somehow he has tried to make it look like a good self pick technique)
RNGs are not transparent... At the same time we don't/won't know whether the mechanical devices(ball machines) are fool proof...
It all involves millions and billions and can easily evoke people's evil mind to do unthinkable stuff(including plotting and scamming)
Texas United States
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January 30, 2010
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Yep, another great discussion containing all the reasonable commonalities with how the states honestly overkill their draw process while under the guise of promoting randomness and integrity. As usual, amber and grwurston infuse this conversation with pure common sense based on tons of observations and experience. Others have contacted their local lotteries with great questions pertaining to all this madness only to receive very limited or no correspondence. The idea of an RNG (software-driven) machine 'already being programmed to be random' but they still conduct pre-tests is completely insane to me. I have always agreed with grwuston on the idea of there being only one 'clean draw' per session meaning no pre-tests and no post-tests at any point. What's so unreasonable about that? It'll save on all the wear and tear on the machines which WE pay for and it'll put all the players' minds at ease as they'll view it as being 100% fair.
As well, amber and I have always agreed that BEFORE heading off to work in the morning, or anywhere for this matter, that we DON'T need to start our vehicles up to (5) times to make sure that the starter WORKS and that the engine will START. The starter is a mechanical apparatus which is certainly subject to failure at some point BUT, it's only common sense that grinding on it that much as opposed to only once and being on your merry way will certainly EXPEDITE FAILURE.
I hate it when people tread on my intelligence. Good conversation.
Small games, frequent wins, and regular payouts 'cause.....
There are seven days in the week...'Someday' isn't one of them.